MGTOW(MSTOW) Should embrace the TFL movement

MGTOW(MSTOW)  Men Sent Their Own Way should begin embracing the TFL/incel movement instead of calling us a bunch of losers.  Nearly 100% of men who are MGTOW are living TFL/incel but will never admit to it because they see it as unmanly/uncool.  They see this as unmanly/uncool because they  still deep down care what the cunt thinks of them.  This is just common sense, just like the PUA movement.  The PUA hates TFL/incel with a passion and works even harder to shame us than the women do.  Talk about self hatred.  All PUA’s I have ever known were incel, myself included, but try to convince themselves that they are not to appease women.   Just as Bill Greathouse said, PUA could not exist without TFL/incel.  A simple case of problem, reaction, solution.  Well MGTOW/PUA, what is unmanly/uncool is to be so insecure that you actually care what naginas and the cunts think.  MGTOW is TFL/incel, just like PUA is.  This infighting between men’s groups is getting us nowhere.  This is exactly what the cunt wants.  Once we are all on the same page, only then can we work together as a group to overthrow the gynocracy.  After all, this is the ultimate outcome we all want.

49 thoughts on “MGTOW(MSTOW) Should embrace the TFL movement

  1. Surely you’re not oblivious to currant events. The terrorist/subversive “sleepers” are ALREADY
    in place! It may seem “off topic,” but I assure you it’s not.
    Want girls? Get on the right team. The terrorists and assorted “bad boys” have 1,000’s of
    groupies fawning over them. The Orlando “night club killer,” and Boston Marathon bombers had wives
    that cheerfully accepted their abuse and beatings. Have you seen a BLM demonstration? They’ve
    got “lookers” there as well. Convert to Islam. That’s very chic. Decisive men that know their own minds.
    That’s what women want. Not that they would have a choice anyway.
    But I WOULD get a move on. You only have till September. After that….
    For a clue about how it will be pulled off, listen to the song “Moonlight, Feels Right,” by Starbuck.


  2. Actually you’re both full of it. As long as you have a hatred towards women, you really don’t deserve any of us. What absolute horseshit that you say nothing but degrading things about us, and then stupidly turn around and wonder why nobody wants you. You have nothing to offer. You have an ugly personality. You wallow in self pity, and then blame everyone else (of course, only women) because you’re so mentally hideous that it probably constantly reflects in your every day attitude. Until you admit that all of your problems are stemming from yourself only, you will be whiny and alone. Don’t particularly care about any attacks this might generate, because honestly, it’s the only tactic of a small mind. Your problem is you. If you honestly hate us that much, either go gay or leave us alone. We don’t like “bad boys”, you just pretend that’s what we’re into because then it gets you off the hook for your nasty worldview. Women who allow themselves to be abused are usually that way because of parental abuse. Not because we think that’s so cool. What you are promoting is abuse of women. So naturally, in your twisted mind, that would make you attractive to us. That is ultimate proof that the problem is you and your childish lashing out. If people like you are going to go around claiming women can’t have your situation, then buddy, you can’t possibly be going through it, either. That’s giving us power we don’t have. It also proves that you feel inferior, and lashing out like a preteen is your only way to deal with it. It’s really pretty pathetic. Maybe you should be lashing out at other men for having something you don’t. Just ignore the fact that you don’t have it because of a complete lack of common decency. Because you’re more abusive than most of the men you think “get all the girls”.


  3. All I can say to that is read a book titled “Red Flags,” by attorney Wendy Patrick.
    She-and many other women-ADMIT that women are attracted to “bad boys.”
    At the very least women like Alpha males.
    As far as “sour grapes” are concerned, I admit that it’s best to have an upbeat attitude however
    unfair you think you’ve been treated-male OR female. And I also think that many women SETTLE
    for violent men because very few men have the combination of aggressiveness AND tenderness
    that women crave. It’s a very difficult balancing act. They’d like a man like “Captain Kirk” from the
    old “Star Trek” series.
    And yep, ugly men just aren’t going to have a chance. And men won’t settle. The media gives them
    a false sense of entitlement. There really is no answer.
    It’s a moot point because we’re gonna be wiped out soon.


  4. Hi Stacey,

    I’d like to take issue with just one thing that you say (you make a lot of points, but one stands out for now).

    »We don’t like “bad boys”«

    The idea that women like “bad boys” isn’t a male concoction. Plenty of women are open about it, including one who is considered an inspiration for women –

    Note that her advice is to date the bad boys before settling down. Given that most women are hotter in their 20s then their 30s, that means the bad boy gets the better deal than the good guy (and why’s he supposed to go along with this anyway?)

    Of course, much depends on the meaning of bad. A mild disregard for convention (indicating confidence) goes a long way. Or as the Shangri-Las put it sixty years ago:

    -‘he’s good-bad, but he’s not evil” –
    “tell me more ! tell me more !!”

    (around the 55 sec mark) –


  5. Good point Alif,

    I do not know why the cunt just does not admit it only loves its badboy, as that would at least warrant some respect. Just goes to show that cunts do the exact opposite of what they say, ALWAYS.


  6. Like I said. “Captain Kirk.” (For those old enough to remember.) The nickname for him was
    “Intersteller Womanizer.”


  7. Stacey E: Are you talking hate to my buddy Lon Spector? If so, you don’t know what you’re talking about and would do well to plug your mouth and keyboard with cement. Women’s bad behavior is the cause of the resentment. So cut the crap.

    Lon Spector: Hey, long time no talk. Can you tell me what TFL stands for?


  8. I think it means True Forced Loneliness.
    For my book, I think success or failure with the opposite sex is a combination of
    attractibility (Which includes personality) and dumb luck.
    I think the song “Fair Share,” by Seals and Croffs captures the yearning that many men feel
    BEFORE they pick up a gun.


  9. Well there are guys who say: “I’m good looking. I don’t know why I can’t get a girl.”
    Eliot Rodgers wasn’t hard on the eyes.
    As long as you “put your best foot forward,” it all comes down to the Astrology chart.
    “Sex” is in the 5th house of the Astrology chart. Depending on the planets you have there
    and the angles of the planets (Placements) you can have lots of sex, or little or no sex.
    I think knowledge of Astrology can save lives.
    Let’s say you find out you have a crappy chart. You see that “it” was never meant to be.
    Instead of striking out at random people you decide whether it’s worth it to continue beating your
    head against a stone wall. Maybe, if you can afford it you spend a few thousand dollars on a
    realistic silicon doll. You make the best of a bad situation.


  10. Lon,
    I must say, I find your post comical. I don’t know how in the world you figure that astrology could determine anyone’s fate. We live in AD 2016. I’ve never heard any substantiation to that whatsoever. I’ve only heard it debunked.

    I know for a fact that a man’s success or failure with women largely depends on whether or not he has a disability.

    An interesting fact: In WWII Adolf Hitler issued German soldiers a blow up doll which was folded into their backpack. He did that so that they would theoretically stop seeing prostitutes and catching terrible diseases. But that’s too weird for me. I’ll stick with my hand! LOL

    Have a nice evening/morning


  11. Have you ever had your Natal Chart done? You might be surprised.
    Pay particular attention to the 5th house.
    Surely, you’ve heard of men who claim that they are attractive and still can’t succed with women.
    Sucess or failure must be based on more then just appearence.


  12. Lon,
    I’m willing to check out this natal chart if it is free on the Internet. But I won’t pay any specialist, who I view as crooks. So how do I determine this free on the net?

    Women do not care about men’s physical appearance as they are not visual like men. Women are crazy about microscopic variations in personality.


  13. There’s plenty of free Astrology chart offers on the net, to wet your appetite. Just Google them.
    I agree totally about “predicitive” Astrology. It’s largely a failure. They interpert “symbols” after
    the fact. If they do predict it’s lucky guesses. To me, Astrology is useful to gain a character portroit.
    You can predict likely behavior, oppertunities, and motivations.


  14. Lon.
    I just had 2 different websites calculate my horoscope. I focused on what they said about love, sex, and relationships. They both made me out to be a highly popular lover (the exact opposite is true), and a very unconventional lover (the exact opposite is true). TOTAL BULLSHIT.

    And again, it has nothing to do with Christianity. So you need to forget this counterproductive crap!!!


  15. A “Cheapo” chart probably would tell you what you want to hear to lure you in for $$$.
    Would anybody WANT to be told they’re going to die a virgin?
    Tell me what planets are in your 5th house. That can’t be hidden. If you have no planets in
    the 5th house, tell me what’s in the 8th house.
    It works for me, is all I can say.


  16. Then she should go to the Mid East or Europe. Oh, wait. She can just stay here in the U.S.
    She’ll get what she wants after November 8th.


  17. And just imagine the insanity….

    She’d let her own daughter, sister, whoever, be obliterated to shit by a Sacred Class like a Muslim or Hispanic, and I mean literally decapitated, but she whines about white males (who she wants slaughtered to the last) expressing their frustration. You just can’t be more insane. She’d burn a white male toddler, she’s break it’s fucking head into pieces, but she whines about white males expressing their frustration here.


  18. It’s all in the public record for everyone to see.
    Did you know that they are so brainwashed in Germany and Sweden that they either don’t
    report the rapes or they APOLIGISE to these vicious rapists for reporting them?
    These white dunderheads are placing their daughters on the alter of sacrafice simply because
    the rapists are “oppressed” non-white savages. Aren’t the girls just as violated and dead if a non-white
    person commits the crime? Sheer Satanic insanity.


  19. Lon,
    You said “well, astrology works for me is all I can say.” But if it only works for some people than it doesn’t work at all. Even a broken watch is right twice a day, so some people’s broken watches accurately tell the time when they look at it. And regardless, horoscopes have never changed your situation. Moreover, it makes it harder for non-Christians to accept your Christianity if you’re involved in what they consider to be ridiculous superstition. It’s a potential stumbling block.


  20. Lon is right about one thing — natal chart astrology does work. I’m sorry you guys are struggling with women & I wish there was some way I could help. Stacey is correct that if you hate women, then you won’t have much luck b/c we can sense that kind of attitude & stay a mile away. Maybe lower your standards a bit, too.


  21. LMAO, YOU are asking US to lower our standards? Most incels would be happy to have a chance with a woman who is remotely in a comparative league to them attraction-wise. I see all the time, fat, dumpy, fugly looking women with chads, female 3/10s with male 7/10s and up. Most incels are average looking men who just want an average looking woman who isn’t stuck up and judgemental. Incel won’t stop being a thing until WOMEN lower their standards. Superman is a pipe dream.


  22. “Stacey is correct that if you hate women, then you won’t have much luck b/c we can sense that kind of attitude & stay a mile away.”

    But this simply isn’t correct, at least not for women like Stacy and you. It would stand for non-feminist women but you are not such women. You are immensely attracted to disrespect and hatred,


  23. Hello guys,

    I’m back!

    Now I think reproduction itself is the root of most social problems. Evolution favors organisms that go out of their way to reproduce, including sacrificing their own lives and murdering others by copying and pasting them while those smart enough to see through it are removed from the gene pool. This is why anti-male behaviors existed in the first place. The problem isn’t even about sexual reproduction. Instead it is about reproduction, sexual or asexual. Everything else is downstream from the root evil of reproduction.

    Reject reproduction and embrace life.


  24. Rationalist, you are intelligent enough to know why that is silly. Reject reproduction and you throw away life for you don’t prolong it. That’s why I have a daughter and want to produce more children.


  25. How is your daughter an extension of yourself? She doesn’t even have all of your genes. Does she feel what you feel? Nope. Is her mind a copy of your mind? Nope. Is her body a copy of yours? Nope. You are a man and she is a woman. She doesn’t even have the same organs you have.

    Even a clone isn’t an extension of oneself. If someone clones you and then kill you, are you alive or not? Nope.

    You are unique. Enjoy YOUR life. Do not live for a family.


  26. We will get transhumanism soon. Why not prolong your own life instead of considering someone else an extension of yourself which is factually inaccurate?


  27. My daughter is an extension of myself as much as any child is an extension of her parent/father. Unless I could clone myself it is the best I could get.

    As for enjoying my life, you forget that sane men best enjoy life with a wife and children. That’s how humanity worked since before we even adopted first civilizations. As for transhumanism and such big words, a lot of things have been “coming” for a long time. This is 2018. In 1998 it was expected we’d all have robots and flying cars. Didn’t happen. We got Twitter and Tumblr. Fschmidt is correct that nothing really substantial is moving since about 2000. I expect technological decline, not improvements, due to devolution caused by feminism. We’ll be lucky if we remain on 1950s levels soon.


  28. @Caamib Nope. A child is not an extension of a parent. This is a fundamentally absurd idea invented to trick people to reproduce. I think you should read Jonathan Haidt’s works. Basically any natalist argument that isn’t collectivistic is just rationalization of what nature tricks you to do.

    Traditionalism isn’t pro-male for the same reason why feminism doesn’t “liberate men” due to it freeing men from stereotypical roles. Under traditionalism you have to feed your wife. That’s something I will never do. I’m too selfish to have a family. You just reject one branch of the scam of reproduction (liberalism) to embrace another (traditionalism). You are still scammed.

    Having a wife isn’t natural because a typical Savanna hunter-gatherer has lots of sex with more than one person. Embracing the natural way of life is embracing the Savanna and rejecting civilization. We are doing better than Savanna people precisely because we can reject demands of the Savanna. It’s not true that what is natural is benefitial. After all diseases are natural. Seduction is natural. Modern medicine and robots are not. The future must belong to the artificial, not the natural.

    Technologies will not decline because East Europe and Northeast Asia exist. If the West unfortunately fails (Islamization is a downgrade but it can not kill the West, on the other hand Savannaization can) we will bear the burden of leading the world. Don’t worry. We aren’t remotely as degenerate as the modern West.


  29. I’m with you on rejecting civilization , the whole sexbot thing is a massive trap (problem>reaction>solution). There are 2 types of traditionalism, patriarchal and gynocentric. In both, men are protectors/providers, but in patriarchal traditionalism women can not vote on anything, have no authority (except over their children), can not work outside the home, this balances the power so that men and women have equal privileges (just different privileges, according to each gender’s biology). In gynocentric traditionalism, women have equal rights without equal responsibility, they get to “vote” just for being female, whereas men have to sign for selective service to “vote.”

    Reason why I put paranthesis around “vote” or “rights” is because politically, what we call “rights” are privileges, a different kind of privilege than natural gender privileges for either gender, these are privileges which can be legislated to and from by an opportunistic government who never has our best interest in mind.

    I’m personally an Anarcho-Patriarchist, AnPat. Small patriarchal communities of around 200 or less, the bigger the group gets, the smaller the individual becomes and the more powerful (and greedy) the authorities will become. We’re not designed to live in large centralized “nations” or “states.” At least in smaller communities we can filter out the corruption going on, not to say it would be perfect but then there is no perfect system, but I think this is the best (based on human biology)….


  30. @marty It is nice to hear from you again!

    Well I have to disagree with traditionalism. The main problem with traditionalism is that it isn’t even an ideology. In fact nothing can ever be done if universal parental authority exists, including enforcing traditionalism itself! Liberals can also reproduce. What if a child of a liberal wants to join the alt-right? If you allow parental authority to exist then the liberal parents can force their son or daughter to renounce alt-rightism.

    I’m a fan of transhumanism because I don’t think it is possible for humans to outcompete AI.


  31. I’m not a traditionalist, I do agree with certain traditions however, the ones which serve a purpose. Patriarchy is needed to keep female hypergamy in check (through meritocratic means, ie enforcing monogamy, on both genders), as this destroys societies and leads to all sorts of feminist movements and shit. Also, at least for now, parents can’t totally control what their kids believe, if their parents are too overbearing and liberal, chances are the kid will grow up to be a conservative, either that or he’ll have enough brains to see past this silly liberal/conservative farce.

    As for transhumanism, I’ll leave you a video that will tell you why I’m not a transhumanist.


  32. Rationalist, sorry but the shit you’re saying is just batcrap. It’s just as nutty as when you were a fundie Christian.

    I won’t even go into everything and your fundamental denial of human nature (there is a mile of difference between non-Savanna behavior and the kind of shit you support, and a sane solution was monogamy/patriarchy) but will just ask you this – do you think you will convince even 1 percent of people that reproduction is bad? Do you think you will convince the dumbest and least educated ones, who usually tend to reproduce most? And that’s why you have lost already and your theories are literally… well, not of this world.


  33. @caamib I do not expect my antinatalist ideology to be popular at all. Ironically the very action of spreading rational antinatalism is inherently dysgenic. The more intelligent people realize the nature of reproduction as a natural scam the lower fertility rate intelligent people will have. Savannaization and fundiefication will accelerate.

    There is a distinction between a factually inaccurate idea and an idea the public can not accept. My ideas are debatable even if almost no one is willing to accept them for biological reasons.

    There is also a distinction between an androcracy and a patriarchy. I’m not sure about which one you and marty actually support. Androcracy means “rule by men” while patriarchy means “rule by fathers”. I obviously do not have problems with androcracy other than requesting that STEM people and other people who happen to be women be exempt from it. On the other hand I will never accept a patriarchy or a matriarchy in any situation because such social systems torture young adult men who are supposed to be innovators in this Age of AI instead of obeying whatever arbitrary will and ideology their parents have. Parentism is fundamentally against every single ideal and ideology on this planet because there are always people who support it against their parents’ will.


  34. Parentism is fundamentally wrong because it allows unchangeable social relations to arbitrarily determine truth. No ideology can survive parentism, be it Christianity, Islam, atheism, Communism, Nazism, Zionism, Liberalism, Alt-Right, Libertarianism, whatever because every ideology has bitter sons and daughters who support it against their parents’ will. If any ideology to allow parentism to be unchallenged it allows some of its most zealous supporters to be persecuted.


  35. “@caamib I do not expect my antinatalist ideology to be popular at all. Ironically the very action of spreading rational antinatalism is inherently dysgenic. The more intelligent people realize the nature of reproduction as a natural scam the lower fertility rate intelligent people will have. Savannaization and fundiefication will accelerate.

    There is a distinction between a factually inaccurate idea and an idea the public can not accept. My ideas are debatable even if almost no one is willing to accept them for biological reasons.”

    So what’s the point of debating it, really? I also believe there isn’t much value to human existence and would just like to end it, but since I don’t have the means I have to play along the best I can – even if it means using mentally ill women or rape. Since people will not stop breeding discussing this is as useful as discussing the benefits of a violence free world. It’s just a pipe dream and basically everybody in the world has better things to do than discuss such fantasies. Will reply to the remainder later…


  36. @caamib Because truth is truth no matter whether it is popular? Unpopularity does not imply factual inaccuracy. As long as my idea isn’t necessarily factually inaccurate it is an interesting topic.

    BTW could you please respond to the rest of my posts?


  37. >Nearly 100% of men who are MGTOW are living TFL/incel but will never admit to it because they see it as unmanly/uncool.

    Keep telling yourself that. Older men in MGTOW are divorce raped guys with children, while the younger ones are smart enough not to fall into the same trap. Sure, there are incel infiltrators in MGTOW who want to ruin the whole community, but they either come around or their cognitive dissonance drives them away. Finally, you incels don’t even realize your luck: you won’t get divorce raped, you won’t have to pay insane amounts of child support, you won’t get beaten up by white knights just because you rejected a smelly fatty (and then she falsely accused you as revenge) etc.


  38. @Magyar MGTOW So it is also bad in Hungary? Sorry to hear that.

    Well, whatever. Reproduction is basically like a demon and it’s good to not touch it at all.


  39. @Magyar MGTOW Traditionalism is not a solution either. Even in traditional societies men are supposed to feed and sacrifice ourselves to women. Why? Because evolution is real and it strongly favors reproduction over survival. Hence the lives of infertile organisms are the most worthless (see worker bees), then the lives of males (see male praying mantises) and finally the lives of fertile females.

    The only way out is to starve the demon of reproduction through refusing to reproduce.


  40. @Unknown Unknown

    >So it is also bad in Hungary?

    Not yet in practice, but the foundations are already there. Our constitution openly discriminates against men, the Istanbul Convention has been signed (waiting for ratification), women have preferential treatment in the pension system and white knights and their vigilante justice more frequent and more dangerous, and female nature is just like everywhere else, they just put on the act a bit better than American women. I predict that things will change for the worse in the next decade or so.

    >Traditionalism is not a solution either.

    Indeed not, and writing about it is in my backlog. You see, I post once or twice a month, and I have other stuff coming up, but it’ll be there eventually.


  41. Magyar, you make a good point about what intelligent men already know, that right wing governments alone can’t make women and laws good and that Hungarian women (just like Polish ones) are pieces of shit that deserve only the worst. But your solutions, like with all MGTOWs, are wrong. Men aren’t just going to abandon women. You should leave for a country where there is no feminism and if not should use Hungarian women without paying attention to some “con…ent” nonsense. Well, you know what I mean.


  42. @caamib

    High IQ races have little romantic hope in the fucking Savanna simply because we evolved to be workers, not Savanna savages.


  43. @caamib

    MGTOW, at its core, is a group of bachelors and divorced men that have some level of understanding female nature, and the acronym helps to find each other online. It’s not a way to fix society and it doesn’t even aim to (although it might by side effects). It does help men not to base their self worth by female validation (or the lack thereof), and I’ve also come across MGTOW/MRA “hybrids” online.

    As of the migrant “rapes”, you shouldn’t take women’s words at face value. Sure, it does happen sometimes, but what prevents her from lying about getting raped upon getting caught? Women lie about rape all the time to get sympathy and attention (and money if the target is rich), and now it’s time for them to “cash in” from right leaning orbiters too.


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